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Sweating over the next 14 days

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Street Hawk
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 07:35

Last night on the way home on the Leics/Notts border I came through a 4 section speed trap.

1 marked Volvo police car at the bottom of a hill, 1 unmarked white BMW coupe car with camera at the brow of a hill and another marked BMW car at the bottom on the other side and another marked Volvo car further down the road.

Speed limit of the road is 60, and as usual I have been keeping to the limit or slightly just above to get overtakes in.

UK Police ACPO guide lines for definate prosecution is Speedlimit + 10% + 6mph however most forces use Speedlimit + 10% +2mph as a more common rule of thumb.

I came up the hill at what my speedo indicated as 62mph, however it was jumping from 59/62.

Now prior to this I went through a village with a 40 limit that had a speed indicator sign.

My speedo said I was doing 40, yet the sign indicated 36/38.

Now theoretically with me doing 62, the radar should have picked me up doing 58/60.

However 2 people at work have been given SP30's for doing 32 in a 30 zone, with 3 points, and £30 fine yet they state that their digital speedos stated that they were doing 30 at the time.

After all the speed limit is a limit and not a target speed. This although a bit embarrassing as my dad has no points on his license thru over 40 years of driving. Although I was not followed or requested to pull over, I am concerned that I am still going to get a NIP (Notice of Inpending Prosecution) through the door.

Is it worth taking my bike to my local dyno to see if my speedo is really inaccurate and get written proof. As digital speedos use the front sprocket for the speed, whilst analogue speedos use the front wheel. And then go to a solicitor to contest if it proves that my speedo reads more than what the acutal speed is if I do receive a NIP.
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f-4

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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 07:40

Most speedos read at least 10% fast. A simple way to calibrate is to use a satnav - the speeds are accurate enough to see how far out the speedo is. My Ka says 66 at a true 60. Sweating over the next 14 days 47559
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JG71
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 08:12

Or if you do get a notice.Ask to see the calibration of the Speedo guns,as they are supposed to be checked every day.That is fact Lee
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Trenchard

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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 08:52

Street Hawk wrote:
Now prior to this I went through a village with a 40 limit that had a speed indicator sign.

My speedo said I was doing 40, yet the sign indicated 36/38.


The signs that light up in villages are notoriously unreliable and usually set a couple of MPH lower than the actual limit, so don't try cross checking your speedo with one!

The rule of thumb ie speed limit +10% +2 MPH is just that and constabularies can if they wish set the camera to the speed limit ie 30Mph in a 30 Limit etc. This is worth watching for if transiting through Wales where the Chief Constable is a p**t using speed cameras as cash cows Sweating over the next 14 days 198814

The question to ask is - do I want to spend XYZ amount on proving something about something that might not even be going to happen.

Sit, wait and react to the NIP if required, if nothing arrives spend the £30 you've saved on a bottle of wine, a takeaway and enjoy!
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headset 57



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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 10:46

Being in the Job i'd say it's unlikely a speed trap,more an ANPR Op,hence the number of 'catch cars' in position.
So,unless your car's known to Police or has no tax, Mot, Ins, etc,in which case you'd have been stopped there and then, probably not a speed check Op. Seems too many rescources for just a speed check, although granted they may have had a hand held in use.

http://www.cctv-information.co.uk/i/An_Introduction_to_ANPR

Quote: Or if you do get a notice.Ask to see the
calibration of the Speedo guns,as they are supposed to be checked every
day.That is fact Lee

http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/

Not a fact and they only need to be calibrated before use,usually with at least 1vehicle, but that is down to the operator if they wish to do more.If it doesn't get used that day, not required.


Last edited by headset 57 on 2009-09-09, 12:21; edited 2 times in total
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Street Hawk
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 10:58

This was a definately a speed trap, as Leicestershire Police had one over the border in the 40 zone last week. Only 1 marked Ford Mondeo estate with camera and a speed board.

Sadly the stretch of the A6006 from Rempstone to Sutton Bonnington is notorious for bikers and high performance cars to reach silly 3 figure speeds.
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headset 57



Location : LHR
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 12:24

Street Hawk wrote:
This was a definately a speed trap, as Leicestershire Police had one over the border in the 40 zone last week. Only 1 marked Ford Mondeo estate with camera and a speed board.

Sadly the stretch of the A6006 from Rempstone to Sutton Bonnington is notorious for bikers and high performance cars to reach silly 3 figure speeds.

A bit of both i'd say as with the techy bits and bobs not many stand alone traps are set these days.
But i see your point!.
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old_git




Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 14:03

Lee. assuming that you were on the bike.

the camera was facing you and you don't have a number plate on the front so how are they going to send you a NIP.

Speed checks are rarely done from the rear (AFAIK)

If you were speeding they would of pulled you up as they would have to do you there and then as they can't check your speed then film you from behind by swinging the camera around which if they did would be a break in the continuity and would not be admissable for evidence of speeding.

also i assume you slowed down a bit as you went past them and would be going slower when presenting the r send for filming if they were in fact filming.

i would suggest as the man in the know says that they were really after bigger fish than minimal speeders.

I really wouldn't worry to be honest, as i think they would of had to pull you there and then if they were going to do you, which if you were doing a ton they would of done.

Geoff
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Fighterfoto

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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-09, 14:31

Speeding is a strict liability offence. This means that you are either speeding or you are not. If you are, then the fact your speedo was giving a false reading is no defence. Whilst it could be used in mitigation, you'd have to show the speedo was inaccurate at the time of the offence. In any event, to argue the point you'd have to reject the offer of a fixed penalty and run teh risk of a more severe penalty at court (aswell as the time and hassle involved).
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hawks922

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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 03:45

In all the times when in a pub discussing Traffic Laws certain gems of nonsense come about

Such as:-

1/ You are allowed to be within +10% of any speed limit - Wrong the speed limit is a maximum there is sometimes a minimum set on certains roads
2/ Minimum speed limit on motorways is 50+ MPH - wrong there is no minumum speed limit unless there is a Blue circle indicating a speed retension of 30 if (or lower if a temporary speed reduction is in place) there is a guidance that a driver must keep to a speed that is suitable to driving conditions and other road users.
3/ If you are caught speeding by a policeman who is alone you can't be done - Wrong I was done 7 years ago by a lone policeman.
4/ If you breach the speed limit going downhill you can't be done - wrong see the reason mentioned in 1/
5/ If you pass a speed trap and you hear nothing after 2 weeks you're safe - Sorry wrong there is no closing date.
6/ The registered owner of a vehicle is responsible for speeding fine and points - Wrong if they can prove you were driving you get the point see rental vehicle agreements.
7/ If you don't have your driving licence they can't give you a ticket - Oh yes they can and give you a producer too.
8/ You can exceed the speed limit for overtaking - ha ha wrong see 1/

Best way to avoid any speeding tickets is ensure that you are below the max at all times even a 2 mph reduction can make a difference.

Ask yourself when was the last time you read the highway code and could you really say you know the speed limits on

Single Carraigeways
Dual Carraigeways
Motorways

For a car, a van, a vehicle towing trailer/car/caravan?

I for one got done once for speeding and since then I rarely go over 50 MPH on motorways or dual carraigeways (always stay in the inside lane), and rarely over 40 on single carraigeways. , I have a more relaxing drive and save a heap on petrol, call me a git but hey I don't want points and want to save cash .
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ringo747

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Location : Near RAF Aldergrove

Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 04:08

hawks922 wrote:
I for one got done once for speeding and since then I rarely go over 50 MPH on motorways or dual carraigeways (always stay in the inside lane), and rarely over 40 on single carraigeways. , I have a more relaxing drive and save a heap on petrol, call me a git but hey I don't want points and want to save cash .

What a ridiculous over-reaction! You got done once for speeding and now you cut 20 MPH off your motorway speed! People like this cause accidents when even the lorries have to overtake you. Madness. Not sure how much you would save on petrol cause it would take you twice the time to get to a destination! Sweating over the next 14 days 345990
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Dunk
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 04:14

ringo747 wrote:
hawks922 wrote:
I for one got done once for speeding and since then I rarely go over 50 MPH on motorways or dual carraigeways (always stay in the inside lane), and rarely over 40 on single carraigeways. , I have a more relaxing drive and save a heap on petrol, call me a git but hey I don't want points and want to save cash .

What a ridiculous over-reaction! You got done once for speeding and now you cut 20 MPH off your motorway speed! People like this cause accidents when even the lorries have to overtake you. Madness. Not sure how much you would save on petrol cause it would take you twice the time to get to a destination! Sweating over the next 14 days 345990

Driving at 50mph on a motorway is one of the causes of traffic snarl ups, as trucks have to overtake you, which then makes all the cars use the one remaining lane.

Mr driving instructor always taught me to drive to the speed limit, when conditions allowed, to keep the traffic moving.

I drive a 4 litre Dodge Nitro, and it goes like the clappers, okay I get through a tank full (18 gallons) every 3 days but it costs me about £15 to fill it up from empty lol!! Sweating over the next 14 days 53197

Whats Great about Britain?!!! Sweating over the next 14 days 253775 hmm maybe thats another debate....
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Flaps
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 04:27

I always stick to just under the speed-limit apart from motorways,where I just join-in with everyone else in the fast-lane(unless they're doing over 80).
I've done 2,000 miles in my Peugeot 308 now and it's averaged 61.5 mpg so far.Not bad eh?
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hawks922

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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 04:57

Over reaction, I don't think so
As far as I can see, no other road users pay for my vehicle nor add any funds to my petrol costs. Any driver who feels the need to drive over the speed limit gambles their licence a gamble where they can't complain when they get caught, can't do the time don't do the crime. As for my driving 50 I cause accidents yeah right whatever I drive at 05:00 in the morning and at my time of leaving work I travel the M54 and M6 at 16:00 when I am lucky if I can exceed 50 mph an hour especially between Junction 10 and 5 of the M6. It takes a Truck to pass me no more than 15 seconds to pass me since they are usually doing 58 - 60 mph, snarl up, yeah right keep dreaming. Do you suffer from road rage do you need counselling ring 0800-I-AM-A-NUMPTY Sweating over the next 14 days 253775

It is the numpties who have this belief they rule the roads and think because someone else doesn't fit their speed requirements cause more accidents by tailgating trying to undertake, speeding along in adverse weather conditions without a care in the world or other road users and worst of all go around with a Barrack room lawyer attitude that they are right when doing wrong.

By the way, points on licences don't make prizes but they do put insurance premiums up.

Calculating the costs of driving at the speed limits allowed cost me about an extra £12 a week which is about £50 a month on a 2003 Ford Focus 1.6 doing 420 miles a week. As for the extra time 15 - 20 mins on the journey if I do 50 - 55


If other drivers don't like people who stick to the rules of the road or can't obey the laws of the road then maybe they should use the Bus or train.


Last edited by hawks922 on 2009-09-10, 05:17; edited 1 time in total
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ringo747

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Location : Near RAF Aldergrove

Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 05:13

Your doing your best to sound like a complete idiot! You do realise there is an in-between here. I am not talking about breaking the speed limit. I am saying that if the limit is 70 and I do 70 that is much more considerate to other people and is less likely to cause smashes because of some idiot in a car hogging the slow lane and making lorries overtake. You do realise that if you do 70 in a 70 speed limit you will not get points. 20 mph of a threshold for you is plain crazy. If you feel like a wee blue eyed puppy for being so good that you don't even come within 20mph of getting points then i hope it floats your boat!
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hawks922

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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 05:29

I would reply to your comments, but you are boring me, get on with your life Ringo
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Flaps
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 05:33

If you guys want to carry this debate on,can you do it via PM's.
Thread locked for a while.
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Dunk
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 08:45

3-2-1 were back in the room.

Play nice please, no need for name calling.
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Razor61
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 13:48

Hawks,
Without getting abusive and keeping the thread on topic. You are infact wrong.
Going slower than the speed limit does indeed cause accidents and some of the most severe fatal accidents have been caused by drivers going slower than the rest of the traffic and the speed limit.
You only have to listen to the same subject being talked about on the many TV cop programmes whereby they state on numerous occasions that slow drivers cause dreadful accidents.

Also, driving slower than the speed limit creates a phenomina called the "Domino effect" whereby when drivers have to slow down behind you (due to traffic in the other lanes preventing them to take over in time) they then cause other drivers to slow down behind them... it then domino's back very quickly and down the road 1 mile behind you traffic actually comes to a stand still (Stop, start, stop, start situation) and it is this part where the severe accidents take place.
I'm sure you have all come across the phantom traffic jam on the motorways whereby you never see any reason for it to be slowing or coming to a complete halt.
Well, that is the domino effect and it is 100% caused by slow drivers.

If a lorry driver isn't looking properly or is half asleep and the domino effect takes place infront of him then this is the cause of the most horrific fatal accidents when one goes up the back of several cars, squashing them together. (read and view the text/pics of news stories and police programmes).
So, due to one driver thinking he was okay driving 50mph in a 70mph limit, 2 miles down the road behind him/her there is a traffic jam which almost always comes to a stop/start halt situation.... and then some poor person or persons gets killed and the slow driver will never have a clue he/she has caused it because it's happening behind...in the jam they have caused.

I remember once also, in America....when we were once told that if the traffic was going at whatever speed (faster than the limit) then stay with it... don't slow it down because you will cause accidents. So it happens everywhere and common sense should kick in or a look in the mirror. Unfortunately for those stuck at the rear of the jam caused by slow drivers, the last thing they ever do is to look in their mirror and see an HGV coming at speed behind them. It is a sad fact.

So before you start slinging abuse at others who are actually talking sense and a *fact* perhaps you should just listen or watch the programmes, listen to a copper talk to you and so on.... and then perhaps apologise.

My old man was a traffic policeman and so was my uncle up until two years ago and listening to their stories of what went on due to slow drivers makes you feel crap especially when little kids are involved.
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Street Hawk
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 14:00

This happened this morning on the M6 after J7 north bound in the road works, I counted 4 lorries, and 10 cars. Only the outside lane was open.

Took me 2 hours to get from J10 M42 in to Birmingham filtering.


Razor61 wrote:
If a lorry driver isn't looking properly or is half asleep and the domino effect takes place infront of him then this is the cause of the most horrific fatal accidents when one goes up the back of several cars, squashing them together.

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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 14:25

have to agree with the masses on this one, driving slow is definatly a factor towards accidents on our roads. I was gutted when I got 3 points but it was my own fault i was speeding so just dealt with it. When it came time to renew my insurance for the first time with my points i used money supermarket and knocked 600 quid off. So it doesnt put your premiums up!

Hawks dont get so stroppy so easily its only a debate!
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headset 57



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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-10, 16:59

I don't do HORT1's anymore as your all linked to the DVLA database and MIB ( Motor Insurance Bureau ),so i can tell instantly if you've points, banned,no insurance or failed to respond to that GATSO / NIP in the post. Sweating over the next 14 days 924196
It just comes upon the ANPR ( i have a FOX3 Guns sound on our one,along with Richard Wilson saying i don't believe him ). Sweating over the next 14 days 135320

Not saying speed checks aren't done but nowadays it's far more effective to have several units and DVLA /UKBA / HMRC / HA / to do several things at once. We also use a mobile custody suite so we can deal with people at the roadside. Don't forget we can have your wheels away too instantly for some offences. Sweating over the next 14 days 698488

Long way home from Lincs London,on foot....
Also MDP have ANPR installed around a few bases now too!.
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hawks922

hawks922

Location : Birmingham, West Midland (Geordie Born & Bred)
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-11, 00:22

I have not insulted anyone personally on here with the exception of saying that I was bored listening to someone telling me I am an idiot and saying that I want to look like a Blue eyed puppy and I hoped I feel proud about my actions. Other than that if I have insulted some by name then don't waste time just ban me from this site, because I obviously am not mature enough to have adult discussions.

You all have your opinions and far as I understand so do I, in fairness to the discussion I have nothing more to add because I have nothing constructive to say about speeding offences.

Thanks for remarks and all the stuff people have added, I will move along.
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Razor61
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PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-11, 05:28

Hawks,
There is no need to move along, having an adult conversation is what this forum is all about.
We like debates, even if they become a little heated but with no name callings.
Calling someone a numpty is not what is needed in a debate but let's all move along (and discuss this more).

We have had plenty of heated discussions on here.

So, Hawks, no need to 'move on', carry on discussing the opinions. We would like more discussions on this forum, the more the merrier. So please carry on and continue to discuss if you wish too.
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hawks922

hawks922

Location : Birmingham, West Midland (Geordie Born & Bred)
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Sweating over the next 14 days Vide
PostSubject: Re: Sweating over the next 14 days Sweating over the next 14 days Empty2009-09-11, 05:54

Razor not trying to sound funny here, but who by name did I call a Numpty.

I followed this
Quote :
7 - Please be courteous and respectful to other Fighter Control community members at all times. Any posts designed to be deliberately confrontational or are "flamebate"/liabless will be deleted without warning and/or a ban will be put into effect.

Although I have not targetted a particular person, have I and others not recognise this rule of the site by becoming personally involved throwing toys out of the pram and stating Another person is an idiot and other accusations. All the things thrown at me had Hawks922 written in them. My only one comment was to one person to say I was bored with the argument. Simply because everyone has a point of view and entitled to it however I also have my own too, but I found that I was becoming far too defensive and to avoid me going on an insult binge I decided to back away. Then someone said I should possibley apologise sorry guys the devil will skate to work first.

The discussion originally was about Streethawk being worried about a possible speeding ticket and has somewhat gone off track and my actions of not engaging the side topic further I try to put the fires of anger out.

As I said before if I have infact by name insulted anyone to break rule 7 then ban me from the site. I will not be held up by accusations that have no foundation, I am calm at the moment because I can't believe that I am being treated like this.
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