Waddington show has their say....

Admin Location : Birmingham B17

Here Here.

But whats a room i lived in tents most of the time on TSW. Thumbs Up

Location : East Suffolk Spotter Watch Member : yes

On the question of accomadation when we did foreign (Sanicole, Vaerlose,etc....) and UK shows (Shoreham, Duxford, etc...) we always had hotels and RAF shows and RIAT we had uni accomadation or stayed on camp.

I guess this keeps costs down but aircrews prefer to stay in hotels on 'subs' than on camp or in Universitys, I believe the RAF and RIAT are the only ones that do this, though I believe foreign participation gets hotels at RIAT.

The crux of the problem is thus, do we want to attract the more interesting participation with the rising cost of budget to the RAF shows? It seems a small thing but I can assure you when a squadron gets a request to attend a show one of the first things asked is " is it hotels?", it certainly was on 899NAS and on the crews I knew from the air force! Mercenary I know but also fact.

I have no answer Confused

what do others think?

Subject: Re: Waddington show has their say.... 2009-07-15, 01:28

As A positive note, would it be a good idea for one of you mods or some other volunteer to offer their services to the organising committe to act as an enthusiasts liaison / mouth piece / comunicator for the show.

the improved flow of information and the insider involvement from one of US would be a rather nice way to improve the situation as it stands today.

and it wouldn't cost the organisers anything.

Probably get shot down, tin hat on ready.

Geoff

Location : Sheffield Spotter Watch Member : no

Personally, I think the accommodation issue is something which could be addressed if there was any will to do so. I don't imagine for a minute that there is no other statation which is better-equipped to provide accommodation. As mentioned a few days back, the show could be relocated to Cottesmore for example - a better airfield layout, better traffic access and (according to Fighterfoto) an Officers Mess which is partly mothballed (and presumably capable of being de-mothballed for a show week). That's just one example but I imagine there must be others. Who knows? Have they looked? Course not, because there isn't the slightest interest in the notion of moving the show in order to take advantage of HM's flypast (and for other reasons too), just like there isn't the slightest interest in changing any aspect of it. Like I said before, we can whine and moan, or be as constructive as we like, but nothing will change - we'll still be in precisely the same place next year. This isn't to be unfairly critical of Waddington, it's just realism. Waddington have no appetite to do things differently when the show is already a success from their point of view. Why would they? You can't blame 'em really.

Admin Location : Birmingham B17

I am at Cottesmore next week and i will find out if the accomodation is there and get an answer.

As an ex serviceman i do have to agree with the other servicemen here that accomodation is short.

Location : Sheffield Spotter Watch Member : no

I'd be inclined to save your energy to be honest. It's not as if there's even the slightest chance of any show being relocated to Cottesmore! I'm talking in general terms here - as I said, think we can all be pretty sure than no matter what we might say or think, nothing is going to change. Just a fact of life.

Location : Lincs Spotter Watch Member : no

My step-daughter used to work at the uni during the airshow & she was preparing over 700 breakfasts each day - that tells you how many rooms alone would be required - it wouldn't matter twopence if the mess had spare rooms at Cottesmore they would still need external accomodation.

Location : East Suffolk Spotter Watch Member : yes

Good point Mayfly, I think some people think that when an aircraft turns up its just the pilot! Support has to come in also to service the aircraft so for example, if we sent just one Harrier that would be 2 plane captains and 3 supervisors at least. The numbers attending RIAT must be astronimical!

Location : Birmingham Spotter Watch Member : No

I stayed in the mess at Cott a few weeks ago and certainly didn't see any signs of mothballing.

Location : Sheffield Spotter Watch Member : no

Well this is just argument over minor points. I don't think it serves any purpose to get into details of who is wrong or right about accommodation, it's just one point amongst lots of others. The basic point on this matter is that there's one very easy addition to every year's line-up which is overlooked, namely HM's Birthday flypast, and it obviously seems a bit lame to use the question of accommodation as the only reason why the show can't be moved either by date or location, in order to take advantage of it. It's just not plausible. If the will was there it obviously could be incorporated somehow, it's just that the will isn't there.

Location : east midlands Spotter Watch Member : Yes

Sheff wrote:: The basic point on this matter is that there's one very easy addition to every year's line-up which is overlooked, namely HM's Birthday flypast, and it obviously seems a bit lame to use the question of accommodation as the only reason why the show can't be moved either by date or location, in order to take advantage of it. It's just not plausible. If the will was there it obviously could be incorporated somehow, it's just that the will isn't there.

Hear, hear! Clap

Location : Lincoln

Thought I may as well comment on this thread as well following my notes on RIAT.
Firstly though I should state that I have a slight vested interest, having been the boss of ATC at Waddington from 2000-2003.

I don't think there is any doubt that some form of enthusiast participation in the airshow organisation would be beneficial. For those of you who remember John Cayless, he got loads of interesting aircraft to Waddington shows a few years back simply by inviting them at the squadron level. I have also done this (Prestwick 1987 and Brize 1988 for those with long memories!). However, you need to remember that not all countries will allow this sort of approach, referring you to HQ. You also need to remember that we live in the world of the credit crunch, and many countries simply do not have the money to come. Remember, the fuel budget is different from the accommodation budget. They might have the fuel, but not the money for detachments.

I'd also like to comment on some of the things like "why couldn't the Israeli T-6s have come through Waddo?". I could spend hours listing reasons, but one major one (even if you could get hold of them in enough time to sort it) is
why would they want to? I know only to well from my time in the RAF that a large percentage of people involved in aviation have zero interest in going to airshows. They spend all week working around aircraft, why would they want to "waste" a weekend as well.
A few other potential reasons for this particular instance:
a) The Israelis might not want their aircraft to attend a foreign airshow before they have even been delivered.
b) Diplomatic clearance issues would need to be resolved. You cannot just change the routing at the drop of a hat.
c) Raytheon might have a confidentiality agreement with the Israelis preventing them from putting the aircraft on public display before they have been delivered.

Believe me folks, I know from experience that its not simply a matter of picking up the phone and sorting it out 5 minutes later.

Andy Marden

Moderator Location : UK Spotter Watch Member : No

Thanks to Andy and all for the "how it's done" part of the organising.

Deep down you know we all appreciate the time and effort that goes into these things.

Still can't help thinking though that we were short changed this year.

My opinion yes. And yes I respect that there are differing opinions.

Hopefully the aviation enthusiast inclusion offer is a serious offer and good things will come out of it.

Here's hoping for a better, subjective again, 2010!

Location : Birmingham Spotter Watch Member : No

It certainly is a serious offer and one that was discussed just yesterday at FFD - where a member of the Waddo team was busy working on next year's show I hasten to add!

Location : Sheffield Spotter Watch Member : no

You mean we're gonna have to go through all this again next year? Laughing